Pastor Terry Jones — Guilty of War Crimes?
As you probably know, last week Pastor Terry Jones put the Quran on “trial” and found it “guilty.” After promising General David Petraeus and Defense Secretary Robert Gates that he wouldn’t burn it — which would risk a bloodbath in the Muslim world — he went ahead and burned a Quran.
And the previously peaceful city of Mazar-i-Sharif, Afghanistan, erupted into violent protests which killed twelve people at the United Nations headquarters located there.
Pastor Terry Jones is clearly guilty of moral and ethical crimes. Did he do anything illegal? What sort of punishment — legal, vigilante, whatever — should Pastor Terry Jones receive?
Labels: Afghanistan United Nations, Mazar-i-Sharif, Pastor Terry Jones, Quran
posted by Tom Harper @ 4:35 PM
22 Comments:
The man may be an idiot, but all he did was burn a book. There is no law against book burning, per se.
What if it had been a bible instead? You may hear a big outcry from the christian fundamentalists, but still, where is the illegality?
Now, I think burning a Koran and- I endorse the right to do so- is a needless insult to an awful lot of people. As is burning a cross. Or submerging one in a vial of urine. Could he have predicted a bunch of crazed Muslims would respond by sawing peoples’ heads off? Most likely he could. Is it his fault they did so? Not at all.
Does the Muslim world have some version of Gitmo? Why not hand Jones over to them and allow them to put in that place, if it exists.
All Jones' action does is inflame the Middle Eastern world of Islam, and by getting in the news with his actions, he lends a degree of credence to those in our own country who want to burn Korans, and who love saying things like "Hell, they burn th' Bible all th' time over there, so lets burn it all th' time here!"
Which basically amounts to "Hey, their underwear is in am intense bunch all the time about us, so let's have our underwear in an intense bunch all the time about them."
Jones is an idiot, pure and simple. He will make it seem kosher for the more base among us to commit similar idiotic acts which will only "win" more "hearts and minds" in places like Afghanistan and Iraq. If he is guilty of anything, it is only of poor judgment. But his judgment is EXCEEDINGLY poor...
He's an idiot. But he didn't do anything illegal as far as I can tell. At some point you have to put the blame on the Muslims who overreacted and actually did the violence.
I'll say what I said at Tim's blog. We need a law that specifies anyone who burns the holy book of any faith wins an all-expenses-paid, one-way trip to a country where that religion is dominant. All booby prizes must be accepted.
Jones said himself he only considers a small minority of the Muslims to be offensive, but then he trashes them all by burning their Holy Book. Not a great way to make friends, if he wants to (yeah right!)
But this is America and he has that right however throwing him to the Mob is a great idea right now.
If a Muslim group burned the bible on these shores you can bet there will be violence - there already is.
My real feeling is that this guy is insignificant, he barely has a following of 30 and by giving him this much publicity - He can now play with the big boys.
I predict he will have a megachurch in a few years
Erik
BTW Lisa Submnerging a Cross in Urine is Offensive, but Burning one is an act of Terrorism and Intimidation. Big Difference
Actually he is such an idiot that he has almost certainly left him self open to criminal charges.
1.The first one I would investigate would be back around 9/10 when he publicly tried to blackmail the developers of the N.Y. Mosk with threats to the Koran. Extortion
2.His blackmail attempt ended when He accepted a new car under the condition that no one in his Church would EVER be involved with burning a Koran... Clear Fraud and Breach of contract
3.He is clearly running a commercial furniture business out of a property he is claiming tax exempt statis on.
4.Now it gets interesting,There will be regulations for the church statis, State and Local gun laws because Jones and his people were openly and heavely armed.Thier statis as a known hate group, brings all the Federal, state and local laws into play, On top of that we have all the laws thier international web cast must comply with.... It would be very interesting to see how that will end.
And finally what could very well be the game ender.
What Jones planned to do "possed a VERY CLEAR AND VERY REAL Danger to America, its citizens and the men and woman of our armed forces" The Danger level was so unacceptably High that That The Highest Ranking Officer AND The Commander and Chief both personaly instructed Jones on the matter,.. If this isn't an act of treason nothing is.
(There is serious talk of the treason charge being used )
Lisa, does being a moron come to you this naturally? Surely you must work at it?
Your beloved Pastor Jones did something sure to cause pain to Americans. Uniformed Americans. THIS country used to hang people for shit like that. This isn't just a guy burning a Koran-this is a guy burning a Koran knowing full well we have hundreds of thousands of soldiers stationed in areas where your heroes Saint Ronnie and Chimpy have done a great deal to radicalize the population.
Your beloved Pastor Jones is a traitor with blood on his hands. But then, so are YOU.
He is an asshole opportunist who has gotten his 15 minutes of fame. Had you ever heard of this Dbag before? No.
When interviewed and asked if he felt sorry for those who were murdered. He mealy-mouthed that answer but would not say he was sorry.
We all have moral decisions to make on occasion...he knew exactly what was going to happen, so, in my mind, he made an immoral decision in the name of fame. Not illegal...immoral.
He says he's had 300 threats on his life. He and his entourage are packing guns. I wonder if each bullet has Jesus' name on it.
The man is trash.
This is a case where everyone's an idiot, the fundie Jesus freak & hissyfitting Muslims. Fucking hell, man.
I'm in complete agreement with S.W. Anderson.
BTW Lisa Submerging a Cross in Urine is Offensive, but Burning one is an act of Terrorism and Intimidation. Big Difference
So I guess flushing a Koran in the toilet is just offensive too.
I'm going to have to go with the, he's an asshole, but did nothing worthy of formal punishment route.
Not to wrap myself in the flag, but this is the United States, and in the United States, we have a constitutionally enshrined freedom of speech that clearly protects this guy.
Should he be shouted down, certainly. Should he be legally liable for the actions of others, no.
JR he is not my beloved Pastor ,I am not even religious but I am sure you supported our media pushing the "torture" issue which also endangered our troops.
I am just trying to stir the pot here. You are either for our troops or not.
Speaking of being for the troops I never saw so many commercials supporting them than th last 2 years. I guess we are only patriotic depending on who is president.
The pastor is an idiot. But I think the role of Karzai is equally suspect and culpable. His actions were hardly noted anywhere - it was Karzai who publicized them in his own nation which then led to the deaths and the greater knowledge of the actions taken by that idiot (Jones).
http://afpak.foreignpolicy.com/posts/2011/04/04/explaining_the_inexplicable_murder_at_mazar
Personally, I think that we would do best by locking Jones, Osama, Karzai and whoever else you want to add into a room and then throwing away the key.
Lisa
Flushing the Koran down the toilet was used as a form a torture for Muslin prisoners.
They had to know it would have been just more then offensive otherwise they wouldn't have used it.
Erik
Sorry Lisa, your attempts to equivocate two wholly different acts means you are an apologist for your beloved Pastor, and my characterization stands based on your own words. If you are ashamed of your support, then perhaps you ought to rethink it. Like you should have rethought your treason in supporting your monkey's Glorious Oedipal War on Iraq.
lisa the inbred idiot drooled,
I am just trying to stir the pot here. You are either for our troops or not.
FINALLY! Something you and I can agree on. I an 100% against keeping them in no-win situations, and I am totally against using them to satisfy some urge to one-up my daddy. You, clearly, are NOT. So I guess we know who DOES have feelings for our soldiers (of which I was once one, unlike you and your cowardly cabal) and who doesn't.
Yes, he is an idiot. Yes he is an asshole. In this country, one of the few rights we haven't pissed away yet is our freedom of expression under the First Amendment. So I am not ready to join the mob of bumpkins that don't understand that freedom of speech means you don't get to choose what others say.
On the other hand, the role of the media in all of this is depressing and pathetic. Were it not for our media which is woefully lacking in performing its most important function of shining a light on how our government is betraying all of us, no one on the other side of Arkansas - let alone the Middle East - would have ever heard of this guy.
We know there are religious nuts that need very little reason to kill people. But without PR from the media, losers like this guy would be virtually powerless.
JR actually I didn't support Iraq,wherever did you see me write that?
And 2nd I don't support Libya either.
So I wasn't a soldier (but many of my family was/is) and neither was Obama. And we know BJ Clinton"loathed" the military.
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